Husbands and Dads

10 Comments For This Post

1. orlund Says:
   October 22nd, 2008 at 7:50 pm

   I would say that was a poor essay. Just because feminism is taught in college and women who go to college have a more successful marriage proves nothing. There are probably thousands if not millions of variables involved. For example higher education would most likely mean higher paying jobs which would lead to less financial stress at home. Finances are usually a huge problem in marriages.

   Not saying the National Marriage Project is wrong just that their reasoning for their statement is extremely miss leading and incorrect. I never read the essay so I hope they would have done a little better research than that.

2. Sean Says:
   October 27th, 2008 at 1:55 am

   I would not blame feminism for marriage problems. I think it’s more to do with the individual. I’m a Filipino and I see a lot of white men coming to the Philippines to marry Filipinas. These men are very conservative and want a wife that they can dominate over. I think that their attitude is the reason why they have marriage breakups and not because of feminism. I really feel sorry for the Filipino women that get tricked into marrying a man who turns out to be a bad candidate for marriage. Many Filipinos are unaware that these men are seeking Filipino wives because the women from their own countries don’t like them. But in reality, most Filipinas are more educated these days and would reject such men.

3. mjaybee Says:
   November 29th, 2008 at 8:08 pm

   Feminist groups such as NOW have lobbied again and again against such children (and father) unfriendly laws such as those proposed to prevent custodial parent move-aways, for presumptive joint custody in the event of divorce and laws to curtail paternity fraud.

   Your failure to address these very real issues is a symptom of your brief, poorly researched essay, which does nothing whatsoever to prove your point.

4. Randy Says:
   December 26th, 2008 at 4:16 am

   There could be some statistical manipulation. “Only 16% of educated women had been divorced in 10 years”, many may not have ever been married as educated women more often wait. This statistic compared to “46% of marriages fail” with no apparent time limit. hmmm

5. Tommy Says:
   January 22nd, 2009 at 7:56 pm

   I’ve seen and heard studies indicating both men and women who wait longer to marry have a diminished risk of divorce. I think this speaks more about maturity in decision making skills and character values than the very loose connection to higher education and feminist teachings.

   Also, studies indicate that the part of the brain responsible for emotional maturity doesn’t develop fully until ages 23-24. Id like a do-over on most of the decisions I made prior to that age! It’s my contention that length and quality of a marriage directly coorelates to men and women having the ability to base decisions on well-grounded values like “Im not the center of the universe” rather than “Let’s get married as long as it’s fun!” or NEEDING someone and NEEDING to be needed or wanted.

   Other marriage and family studies which interviewed old-age married couples who never divorced reveal that those couples realized life has its ups and downs. They made hard choices to continue loving their spouse regardless. None seemed to have regrets in that.

6. Barry R McCain Says:
   January 28th, 2009 at 11:49 pm

   A load of crap.

7. Turts Says:
   July 17th, 2009 at 6:25 pm

   I don’t understand the link being made here. How can one assume that just because a women graduated from college, she must have been indoctrined into feminism. I am a women who spent 7 years in college and I never took one feminist or women’s studies course. As a matter of fact, if I had taken some feminist courses in college and believed them, I would probably not be happily married today (after 19 years0. The reason why women who are college educated are more likely to have a successful marriage has a lot more to do with the demographics and family backgrounds of the type of women who attend college (usually white, middle and upper class, educated, dual parent families) as opposed to women who do not attend college (usually minorities, lower social class, more likely to be the product of a single mother or broken home, low parental education.) That is a scientific fact.

8. joe46 Says:
   September 8th, 2009 at 1:18 am

   I think the problem is that feminism was a reaction to the perceived as well as actual imbalance of male power in society. The problem with this is that while it sought to free women from undesirable roles and responsibilities seen as being solely male imposed while granting them the same rights and freedoms men supposedly enjoyed. It was never intended to fairly balance and redefine our gender roles. It was never suited to achieve equality, or fairness while recognizing that such equality would not necessarily mean identical roles and expectations. It failed to recognize the interdependence of the gender roles and how they can not change in a vacuum without affecting the other.

   For example it failed to consider the each gender role had not only rights but connected responsibilities and expectations associated with it. It also failed to recognize women’s influence in society on these same roles.

   Women berated the men for feeling they needed to pay men higher salaries and favour them for promotion. Yet women continued to instil, and perpetuate the notion in men from boyhood that their manhood was dependant on their financial worth, success and achievement. Men are also derided for being insecure about their wives our earning them. Yet women refer to men who are not successful (regardless of their on own success or lack there of ) as “losers”. It’s not clear why women who fail to achieve are not branded losers but it is clear what a male loser is losing and is his manhood , worth and the love and respect of women.

   This label is applied to men who would choose to raise children while the wife worked as well.

   Did feminism consider that men must be free from these responsibilities and labels and free to share in the traditional women roles as they choose ? Did it tell women they that everytime they asked for an engament ring , or judged the suitbity of mate on these financial and success baised critera that they were perpetuating male attitudes that told men they needed to earn more and get more recognition ? Did it realize that it was not just the perception of female inferority or some willfull sexist plot that compelled men to think men needed this recognition more ? That perhaps women had instilled these notions of worth and manhood the man himself and that this was only natural he would emathize and recognize if not project this need onto his fellow males when considering salaries and promotions ? No it did not.

   All manner of male rights have their own responsibilities attached. Women have the right to enlist and serve in the army but do men really all want to be drafted and sent to the front lines to be mutilated and die in a war ? What did scocity tell men to get them to make this sacrifice ? it told them they were doing it for the women and children back home.

   Marriage and divorce laws of course are still designed to punish the powerful male who bares responsibility for failed marriage. It is designed to help and protect the supposed inferior, dependant, virtuous and pure women.

   Male sexuality has been laid out in all it’s supposed self-serving vile glory to the point men are well aware of their urges and tenancies how these must be channels and worked around for the sake of marriage.

   Women long repressed sexuality has however been cloaked in a veil of chaste and nurturing emphasis and the natural response when seeking to free women of sexual ignorance and repression has been to assume an emphasis on an unapologetic and co-opted form of male sexuality. This male indulgence in physical attraction and casual satisfaction (while always present in women’s sexuality to a degree just as mans ability to nurture and care for the emotional needs of his children has been ever present to an extent.) is not necessarily the true freed female sexuality but an attempt to have what men are seen as having.

   This is all further compounded by the false ideals placed on women primary mating behaviours as being universally altruistic and an absolute entitlement without out explanation.

   What do I mean by that ? Many Women have an inherit biological mating strategy that informs there libido and romantic satisfaction. This is in fact a process of soliciting the sexual interest of multiple males who compete for them , passing their tests and once chosen or selected demonstrating commitment and a willingness to share resources for raising offspring.

   Women call this romance. The man convinces her he is the bast mate and may bring gifts of flowers, jewellery and so on which is romantic so long as the women feels she had adequate options and choice among competition. Only then is the chosen males display welcomed. We see this in the animal kingdom and primates do this quite extensively and the male bringing his offering of meat or vegetation and having competed successfully mates 60% more often.

   Why is this glorified however as something we call being romantic and why is so pure and noble while the males attraction and stimulation by physical traits that suggest fertility is demonetized ? Some women go so far as to make men physically fight over them by instigating or picking up a stranger while they are out together so her beloved can get beaten up or stabbed. Most women settle for social and emotional competition.

   Women are largely ignorant of their own motivations in this respect however and in marriage this proves a disaster. While the man is aware of his needs and attempts to address them in a positive manner inside the relationship the women has been conditioned to feel assisting in his sexual fulfilment as degrading and his use of pornography is an insult and even looking at other women when she is not around unacceptable.

   The women however begins to complain how the husband has changed after marriage. While it’s true most men are relived to no longer have to endure the burden of competing and proving themselves worthy and look forward to the security , emotional and sexual fulfilment they believe marriage should bring this is opposed to women nature. Men may be attracted to variety and they at least know this for what it is and can deal with it and choose to make this sacrifice. Women attraction and in fact their sexualities dependence on freedom and selection of completing males is relativity un-recognized. Any of these tenancies we call romance and say it’s universally validated and must be appeased. Imagine if in society we had this same attitude of nobility and entitlement towards mens propensity to variety ? Actually this was the case once in the long ago past as husbands were permitted to have physical affairs as long as they were emotionally and financially commited to the wife. The wife own mother would chastise even the slighted hint of dissatisfaction with her husbands affairs as completely unreasonable.

   The fact is that for a husband now days just doing things to show he cares (fixing her car) or desiring sexual intimacy in and of themselves are not considered “romantic”. What is romantic then ? The women may complain of a lack of romance and the husband may endeavour to do romantic things again and show he cares even as his own needs and happiness have taken a back seat having little importance beyond being dependant on the women fulfilment before they will manifest.

   Even the same gestures of romance from their husband may seem empty now they are outside of the context of competition and of her having choice among interested suitors. Sex is a duty a chore and her husband the last man she would want to sleep with. She wonders why she can’t explain her dissatisfaction to her frustrated husband who’s being treated with disdain and who’s sex life has completely dried up.

   Then to make matters worse around this time is about when that experience of the chemistry and the high that is temporary with a new lovers starts to wane. This neuro-chemical cocktail wares off after a few years (3 to 7 )or after child birth and women have been conditional that this feeling should be permanent and that if it fades they have “fallen out of love” with their mate.

   The fact that women’s sexuality has been idealized leads them to be completely ignorant of the motivations for their feelings and behaviours. Not being able to recognize the cause and bring them to the surface for logical examination and to be addressed and they are relegated to rationalizing logical reasons for what they feel like doing anyway after the fact. Of course these false rationalities or the simple “I don’t know why I feel this way” leaves both men and women unable to address he growing unhappiness and lack of sexual attraction to her husband. Surly he has done something wrong though.

   She proclaims she doesn’t feel free to be herself, or doesn’t desire sex with her husband any more or feels bored and trapped. This has happen to couples living together for ten years. They get married and in three the women is miserable. The man insists nothing has changed.

   It doesn’t matter how sympathetic or understanding or considerate her husband may be she feels the way she feels. Society has told her she must follow her heart and women are complex and her feelings and happiness at any given time are of the utmost importance though they may expect them to be inexplicable they need not understand them to act upon them.

   Any failing of a man to understand her and make her feel happy wither or not she even understands her motivations herself is irrelevant (let alone the consideration of his feelings and needs which he is fully aware of and can communicate). This is grounds for divorce. His needs are known and he has learned he can not indulge in the variety of partners he may be attracted too but hers are not and if this occurs she remains unaware of what happened to her sexuality and only knows things don’t feel like they did and she is gone.

   Most women insist on marriage as they still hold the fantasy and there is still often the social pressure from family and friends to get married but all the persistent social, financial and religious pressures that used to go along with marriage end there and it’s good luck after that. Why do women give ultimatums and demand marriage yet 70% of divorces are initiated by them ? All the while we say the evil man won’t commit or has failed to save the marriage then by some how appeasing her. When a women desires mother hood we exclaiming the nobility of her selfness quest yet feminists decry father hood, a father devotion or his desire to have children or even custody of his children as a selfish , narcissist desire to own a little piece of themselves or to live on through their children.

   Divorce is financial devastating to men and countless men who went in search of love and happiness and to full fill their roles as loving husbands and fathers find them selves alone, deprived of their rights to fatherhood, and paying for and supporting the child, and lifestyle of the women in addition to loosing many of their assets. Custody defaults to the mother and alimony and child support are invoked to insure that the child is raised by the mother even if the father could have provided the higher standard of living. Where are the feminists who should be calling for the demise of sexist old property marriage laws that assume the women is some sort of discarded property to be subsidized by the financially powerful man ? All mouths are silent here as they are when ever women take advantage of the benefits assigned to their outdated roles.

   If we ever to achieve happiness together men and women interdependence must be recognized and mens roles have to change to reflect any changes in women roles.

   Because of past oppression or so I’m told (I wasn’t live when the male patricahy had all women brutally enslaved against their will) my voice as a man on such matters is unimportant and my opinions null and void as sexist misogyny should they not be exclusivly feminist. I have doubt at one time women were in diferent gender roles , could not vote etc yet at these times women themselves perpetuated these roles to their duaghters and deridded their peers who strayed from these oppressive roles. They clearly weren’t so miserable if they were complaicent in perpetuating these standards and surly men did not do this alone.

   As a socity we had feminism as a reaction to gender roles however until balanced and equal roles for men and women allow the valuing of differences and make acknowledgement of the responsibility they place on the other gender we a going to see nothing but a cold materialistic, self-serving society full of unfulfilled people, broken families and an abandonment of monogamy and any spiritual (not religious) notions attached to love, sexuality and parenting.

   It has been said women don’t believe in marriage any more and a growing number don’t feel they need a man to be a husband or father and that the single parent family is best for the child as opposed to in which the wife is at all dissatisfied in any way at any point and for any reason. Why not when men are still forced to provide either way ? I have seen women purposely stop taking birth control (a man has no right to choose father hood after all.) I have seen women falsify abuse if the man even threatened to sue for custody against all odds and even though their is no proof this biases a Judge and guilt is assumed.

   I’m not saying women should be forced to stay in a marriage but I am saying men should have equal custody rights and if they are better suited financially to raise a child so be it. Women can work and make good money as well. Men are sick of being oppressors one moment when we succeed and a women dose not , and losers the next when we don’t.

   Men are bound to get sick of being used as disposable males for hard labor and cannon fodder, having our notions of manhood used to exploit us when it suits as has always been the case yet being isolated from any of the privileges once enjoyed to offset our numerous sacrifices. Being demanded to be tough and strong then told we are emotionally obtuse only to be called wimps and discarded when we comply with women’s demands. We are sick of being used as ATM’s and spermbanks, while being told how shallow and sexist we are; being manipulated by women’s sexuality only to be accused of objectifying them when this doesn’t suit them.

   Feminism sought not to have the same rights and responsibilities as men, it sought to acquire the same rights women thought men enjoyed. The grass is always greener though and us men are not all millionaires nor were we ever living the good life at women’s expense. There were always trade offs.

   We can all thank feminism in addition to liberating women on many fronts bringing gender equality one step closer (which I think was a good thing) but also for the creation of hidden and insidious double standards imposed on male behaviour and responsibility and a complete disregard for mens rights and feelings. Why the statement that men are held to double standards by women and suffer inequitable treatment in some areas is tantamount to blasphemy in and of itself due to the perceived past crimes of the supposed male patriarchy.

   Most women now days never stop to wonder if they may be guilty of being selfish in any given individual circumstance or might be ignoring a mans needs or treating him badly but then again he’s a man he’s always wrong, he’s emotionally obtuse, and his desires petty and wicked. Women are pure and virtuous and yet are independent feminists strong and capable at least whenever it suits them.

9. joe46 Says:
   September 8th, 2009 at 1:59 am

   It’s interesting numerous studies (more recent than the 90′s) seem to indicate that educated , professional women are less likely to get married or have children, and those that did are more likely to divorce. Perhaps the lower number of marriages for professional women , or the choice not to have children is responsible for the lower divorce rate. Less marriage means less divorce ?

10. Denis Pakkala Says:
    October 19th, 2009 at 9:16 pm

    The divorce rate is higher for college educated women. You’ve got it backwards Cory, include references whenever you quote statistics.

    The feminists also created a lot of ideological gender disparities in family law, domestic violence, etc. Feminism is not about equality, it is about special rights for the union of women.

    Do some research, this is a poorly written article.

    Read some of Christina Hoff Sommers and Wendy McElroy at ifeminist.com

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